Death of social networking for lawyers is greatly exaggerated

Remember the late 90's when many in the legal profession dismissed the Internet as some sort of fad?

A recent article article in Law Technology News (Is the Party Over for Social Networking?) and blog post by Martindale-Hubbell ('social networking – does not draw lawyers') reminds me of the same. Both write off lawyers use of social networking.

This at a time when LinkedIn, the leading professional social networking site, lists 118,000 profiles from those describing themselves in the practice of law and is profiling each of the largest law firms based on social networking at LinkedIn by their lawyers.

Interesting that many quoted in the Law Technology News story see the advantages and significant growth in social networking for lawyers. Nonetheless, the headline was couched to create the opposite impression.

And the headline certainly worked. New York Magazine citing the Law Technology reported 'News Attendees at the American Bar Association's ABA Techshow in Chicago have declared social-networking sites over.' No question the magazine put this in to laugh at our profession.

Martindale's position that social networking for lawyers is dead? Probably based on a combination of not knowing what is taking place and protecting their territory.

Rather than create sensational headlines to generate discussion or misleading lawyers to sell your products, let's give social networking time.

It's new. Social networking sites are still being perfected. Lawyers and legal marketing professionals are still trying to figure it out.

But like the Internet, social networking for lawyers is not a fad.

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Is Martindale-Hubbell really relied on most often to find an attorney?

Martindale-Hubbell issued a press release last week claiming 'Individuals, Companies Rely On Martindale-Hubbell Most Often to Find an Attorney.'

The basis of Martindale's claim is the 2007 comScore Media Metrix monthly reports measuring traffic patterns at competing online attorney directories. Per the press release, 'comScore reported more combined unique visitors to Martindale-Hubbell sites martindale.com(R) and lawyers.com(SM) than competing directories when seeking a lawyer.'

Nicholas Karrat, Sr. Director, Traffic & Alliances for Martindale, went on to say:

Consumers, small business professionals, lawyers, and corporate counsel seeking a lawyer or lawyer referral rely on online resources designed specifically for their needs, and the results of the comScore reports show that when these individuals go online to look for legal assistance, they turn to martindale.com and lawyers.com.

Google is the biggest competition Martindale-Hubbell has. I emailed LexisNexis PR Manager, Holly Michael, last Saturday asking if Google was one of the competing online attorney directories included in the survey results? No answer yet. Perhaps someone from Martindale will comment here providing an answer.

If Google is not included in the results, you have to question Martindale's assertion that when individuals go online to look for legal assistance, they turn to martindale.com and lawyers.com. The goal in issuing such a press release should be to provide lawyers an accurate picture of online searches for a lawyer, not to demonstrate you get more traffic than Findlaw.

If someone truly wanted to show lawyers where individuals and corporations go online to look for a lawyer, including Google in your report is a no brainer.

Clinging to the past

Only 'teenagers, bloggers, marketers, recruiters, evangelists, self-proclaimed evangelists and sales people (ahem, excuse me – business development professionals)' use social networking sites. Not lawyers. And of those few lawyers who join, almost none are corporate counsel.

That's the word from John Lipsey, LexisNexis VP Corporate Counsel Services, at the Martindale-Hubbell blog.

Strange position to take when:

  • There's 119,000 LinkedIn profiles from those within the 'law practice' industry per a Google search across the LinkedIn directory.
  • A quick search for 'General Counsel" at LinkedIn draws the maximum of 500 search results. There's certainly many more.
  • Like Doug Cornelius, who also found Martindale's position curious, I am seeing an explosion of lawyers adding profiles at LinkedIn.
  • Legal OnRamp, a social networking site for lawyers in private practice and in-house started by Cisco general counsel Mark Chandler, has in its short history more than 175 companies signed up, including several leading U.S. banks and a clutch of major corporates.
  • DLA Piper, the largest law firm in the country is using a Facebook-style networking tool for its trainees.
  • Mike Dillon, General Counsel at Sun Microsystems and Executive Vice President of the company's legal department, finds wikis, social networking, mash-ups, virtual communities and blogs incredibly rich and powerful when it comes to knowledge sharing and communication.

I'll concede that most lawyers have not figured out how to effectively leverage social networking sites. Like the use of Google, Amazon, and other Internet services that no one was clamoring for but which we now could not live without, it'll take time.

Despite Lipsey's 'talking to a couple hundred corporate counsel,' the train is leaving the station on this one, we're not going back.

Martindale-Hubbell the next LinkedIn or Facebook?

Believe it or not I'm not trying to pick on Martindale-Hubbell. I just find some of the things they do or say amusing enough to share with you.

Read today on a listserv that Martindale-Hubbell, in trying to keep a 100-lawyer client in their directory, told the law firm that Martindale would be the new Facebook or LinkedIn for lawyers in due time.

Martindale is saying they will be the next LinkedIn? If that's true, it seems to be totally irresponsible statement.

LinkedIn:

  • As of March 2008, LinkedIn had more than 20 million registered users, spanning 150 industries.
  • As of December 2007, its site traffic was 3.2 million visitors per month, growing at an annual growth rate of about 485%.
  • Founded by co-founder of Socialnet.com & leading exec at PayPal and funded by Greylock, Sequoia Capital, Bessemer Venture Partners, and the European Founders Fund, all tier one VC's funding Silicon Valley companies.
  • Reached profitability two years ago.

Martindale:

  • No management team that I know of that has experience with building social networking sites.
  • Unique visitors to Martindale.com down 13.4% over last year per Compete.com.
  • Struggling with the launch of a corporate blog, something much simpler than software infrastructure and management team needed for successful social networking site.

As far as becoming the next Facebook? Seems rather silly. Makes as much sense as Martindale saying we'll become the next place where all young lawyers will hang out to socialize online. Does anyone really believe that will happen?

Martindale has been a great company as a lawyer directory. But to try and create something that's vogue today by boasting that we're a new company that's introducing Web 2.0 solutions is irresponsible and is only going to damage to reputation of the company.

Martindale-Hubbell blog : Good tool in wrong hands?

I've held back on posting about the Martindale-Hubbell blog. I figured that despite the blog's many shortcomings that others have blogged about, the company should be lauded for blogging. In addition, they just started blogging so I thought things would improve.

Then yesterday, Jonathan Lin, Martindle-Hubbell's Director of Product Management, links to a spam blog in his post responding to my post asking 'Will Google offer better search of lawyer directories than lawyer directory websites themselves?'

By spam blog, I mean a blog that just copies other people's content (in this case, mine and other law bloggers) and republishes it. It's done in hopes to generate a few bucks for law related Google adsense ads run on the spam blog.

Linking to spam blogs is as lame as it gets. I'd give Jonathan more credit if he was doing it to get my ire up. But I'm not sure that's it. I don't know if Martindale-Hubbell understands blogs and what it even means to blog.

Today, Jonathan, responding to others' criticism of the blog concedes he just wanted to get the blog up quickly and would make needed improvements on the fly.

I made the call to get something out there quickly to begin 2008, even with known limitations, so we could at least start the conversation with you all and then make improvements as we go based on real-time feedback.

That’s the web 2.0 way right?

Ironically, I suspect that if we took the other route and did extensive research and development until we were comfortable that we got everything thing figured out, we would have ended up launching in December. And, I bet along the way, we would be equally criticized for being slow moving and “not getting it.

That slower method is how we used to do business, and it’s what we are trying to change.

That may be the 'new Martindale-Hubbell', but to me it's nuts. Martindale-Hubbell is a legacy product that's been around for 130 plus years. As a practicing lawyer for 17 years, the Martindale-Hubbell name meant a heck of a lot.

You hold yourself out as a first class company working with leading lawyers. If Martindale is going to get into something, it's got to get it right. Or least get close. If you don't know what you're doing, get some help. Companies launch good blogs in weeks and months, not years.

To his credit, Jonathan did ask for suggestions today. Here's my quick advice.

  • The blog needs to be outside the Martindale website. Keeping it inside the website makes it look like advertising no matter what you do. You lack credibility using a medium that's all about transparency and credibility. Your blog posts are also going to get cited very little, if at all, in blog discussion when you put something up in a very heavily branded website you call a blog.
  • Create a proper user interface for the blog. You don't get to the home page for any blog or website via a link that's number four in a side navigation bar of 20 other links.
  • Create a proper comments field. There is a reason you are not getting comments. You should not require registration. And in no case should you be attempting to collect demographic information of interest to sales people.
  • Get rid of all the ads & links to your other products. There's at least 25 links promoting various services of Martindale and LexisNexis. A blog is your mouth in a conversation, not a billboard.
  • Set up proper management of your RSS feeds. Best I can tell your feeds are not getting indexed at Google Blog Search nor Technorati, the largest blog aggregators. No one can call when their name, their company's name, or their url is mentioned in your blog. Until you do that, you are shouting in the middle of the forest, as opposed to engaging in a conversation.
  • Create a proper software architecture for SEO. The present set up for title tags, headers, and more is not getting your content indexed properly at Google. Your posts will never be found on search.

You guys have other suggestions? Appears we have Martindale's ear.


Will Google offer better search of lawyer directories than lawyer directory websites themselves?

If you watch Google closely, one of the recent changes you've see is that when Google displays organizations and directories on the search results pages, it's allowing a search of the subject website without having to click to the website.

Look at the below example for the Super Lawyers lawyer directory.

Super Lawyers at Google

Internet users would not need to go to the Super Lawyers website to search for a lawyer. If I'm looking for an environmental lawyer in New York who went to Harvard, I just enter 'environmental lawyer New York Harvard' in the 'search superlawyers.com' box at Google.

Here's the first three results displayed - right in the Google interface without going to Super Lawyers - and in a fraction of a second. When I click on the result I go directly to the lawyer's page in the directory, skipping the website home page and any interim search pages.

Super lawyers Google

Expect the Martindale-Hubbell, Avvo, and FindLaw lawyer directories to be next in line for the Google treatment.

What's the implication? For Internet users, there may be advantages. No limited text fields or 'drop-downs' for search such as by practice area and location, the type of things Martindale-Hubbell requires.

Google's search will allow us to do a search for exactly what we want - like I just did for the Harvard environmental lawyer in New York. I could have added an association or two that I wanted the lawyer to belong to limiting my results further. I'm not sure searches at lawyer directory sites themselves would allow me to do that level of search.

For lawyers, it may be great. People can search for someone matching my background and find me immediately. That's impossible if I'm displayed in a Martindale-like directory as one of 165 lawyers in an area of practice in a locale.

For lawyer directories? I think they'll be uneasy allowing Internet users to search their data without going to the directory's website. No adds displayed. No fancy user interfaces with pictures and the like. No branding of the directory. Lots of confusion with lawyers asking directory salespeople questions.

Where do you see this headed? See advantages for people looking for lawyers? See advantages for lawyers?

For you readers employed at legal directories - Martindale-Hubbell, FindLaw, Avvo, & Super Lawyers - what do you think of the development?

Hubbard One law firm video nothing more than eye candy

That's the word from Joe Campos, a Seattle lawyer, who walked through Hubbard One's booth at the Legal Marketing Association Conference last week. Hubbard One, a law firm website development company for large law firms, was holding a contest asking for ideas and concepts about using video for law firm websites.

I agree [with Hubbard One] that web video can be extremely compelling. Sadly, Hubbard's video advocating the use of video is of such low quality it will probably discourage a lot of prospective clients.

For law firms, web video has to be extremely well produced and must deliver something of real value to clients and prospective clients. It can't just be eye candy. The law firm has to deliver really compelling and useful information and create a reason for website visitors to return, learn and ultimately hire the firm.

Video on law firm websites needs to offer useful information to lay people about the legal issue facing them. Otherwise, Hubbard One and Martindale-Hubbell, also hawking law firm video for websites, are just generating incremental income for themselves from their unknowing law firm customers who believe video will generate more legal business.

At least Martindale-Hubbell, which has not produced informational video that I know of, agrees with me that law firms benefit much more from video relevant to the law firm's clients needs.

Give advice; answer basic questions; describe what typically happens in relevant matters; provide value with timely commentary. As with all good marketing, if you can put yourself in the shoes of the buyer and empathize with them and give a little value, you're more likely going to win the business.

My guess is that if we're going to see informational video, it's going to come from the firms themselves using YouTube, as opposed to companies like Hubbard One and Martindale. Hubbard One and Martindale are likely to charge a hefty price for video. The result being not much video, video which will stay on the website for months or years, and video being focused on the law firm and its lawyers.

Law firm video on websites : Immediately irrelevant

Immediate irrelevance. That's an accurate description of 90% plus of the video's law firms will run on their websites.

And that's not my characterization of law firm video. This from a marketing technology person at one of the largest firms in the country commenting on the mounting evidence that blogging really does work (nice coincidence).

As pressures increase, whether from competition or clients, the need to differentiate and offer value to clients becomes important. Rather than spending $75K on a video for your Web site, try a professional blog. Not only is it substantially less expensive, with one post per week it offers continuing relevancy.

A couple months ago Martindale-Hubbell and their public relations company, Ogilvy PR, announced Martindale's new video on law firm websites service saying in part:

Lawyers are increasingly embracing new ways to differentiate themselves and attract new business while consumers and small business professionals are eager to learn more about a lawyer or firm's philosophy and demeanor prior to hiring the firm.

Take a look at the video on this law firm website (believe its one of the Martindale ones). Does anyone really think a video of lawyers standing around talking at each other, a framed certificate of admission to the Supreme Court, what looks to be an yellow page ad, and some newspaper headlines is going to incent clients to call them?

Martindale is not alone in selling this type of video as 'Web 2.0' technology that law firms are ready for. Look at the video on this law firm website. The theory is that paying a few grand for a video of lawyers talking about the things they do in front of courthouse pillars gets people to stay on the website longer than another website that does not include video.

So what? People staying to watch a TV ad on the Internet. What's the value to prospective clients and people looking for legal information?

Video yes. But let's offer something of value. How about lawyers answering legal questions in their niche? What about doing that on a weekly basis? That's value. That's a real differentiator - lawyers showing they care by taking the time to help people for free.

Those type of video's will also have a viral marketing effect being talked about online, passed to friends, and even displayed on other websites and blogs if archived at YouTube.

Shell General Counsel : Legal directories of little value to in-house counsel

Richard Wiseman, the General Counsel of Shell International Petroleum Company Limited, is horrified by the amount of money that law firms spend on preparing submissions legal directories such as Martindale-Hubbell and Chambers. He can't imagine who law firms think is naive enough to use such directories anymore than they would use the Yellow Pages in locating outside counsel.

Picked that up in an article in UK publication LegalWeek. After talking with inside counsel, they raised the possibility that legal directories are more a self-perpetuating marketing-arena for law firms, as opposed to a useful tool for corporate clients.

John Wallbillich, a former general counsel in the States who turned me onto the Legal Week article, calls Wiseman's a common (and thankfully honest) viewpoint.

These directories serve some purpose, but their influence is more like a citation from a Louisiana state court in a legal brief. It's better than nothing, but in my experience only in limited cases (such as a foreign jurisdiction or a minor matter for local counsel).

Last month John Lipsey, VP of Corporate Counsel Services for LexisNexis Martindale-Hubbell, posted on the importance of legal directories to in-counsel in the lawyer selection process. John conceded personal referrals were twice as important to in-house counsl than Martindale, but still argued based on his survey that 40% of in-house counsel found Martindale as important in the hiring process.

I heard from multiple in-house counsel and lawyers in large law firms, that they didn't believe Lipsey's findings. They thought the survey was self serving and done to argue that Martindale remains relevant in the age of the Interet where referrals are an email or two away and so much information is freely available. Information too that's beyond the scope of a lawyer bio or firm profile. Information that provides a 360 degree view of a lawyer.

Ultimately law firms are going to make the call with their pocketbook. With large law firms leaving directories like Martindale-Hubbell or reducing their listings, law firms may already be making the call that legal directories are of declining value.

Avvo to disrupt Martindale-Hubbell's ratings system

Avvo Martindale HubbellThat's the word from an article in Internet Law and Strategy running at law.com this weekend. From the author, Joseph Campos, Chair of the Corporate/Securities Law Group at Stanislaw Ashbaugh in Seattle:

Since 1868, Martindale-Hubbell has provided the largest library of lawyer and law firm profiles and ratings. Law firms across the country reflexively and dutifully subscribe to the company's hardbound volumes, placing them prominently in their libraries, confident they have taken the most obvious step to ensure clients looking for legal representation will find them. Just as important to such firms is Martindale-Hubbell's peer review and rating system, touted by the company as an objective measure of a lawyer's ethics and abilities. Receiving a peer review rating is a singularly egocentric moment for a lawyer, suggesting he or she had 'arrived' in a professional sense.
......
Today's Web 2.0 business models have completed the paradigm shift by eliminating the barriers to global publication and distribution of client opinions. Companies such as Avvo.com now give clients, as well as lawyers, the power to publish opinions about lawyers easily, instantly and without cost, in a medium that reaches a global audience. Harnessing the concept of 'collective intelligence,' there is now a totality of information about a lawyer available. Consumers can easily search for a lawyer and read what other lawyers and clients think about that lawyer. Lawyers are able to provide far more information about themselves, their practices and their experience than has ever been possible before. Some features provide a way for lawyers to communicate and interact directly with the public and showcase their understanding of the law and legal issues.

The new paradigm is: clients and lawyers rating lawyers for the benefits of clients and lawyers. As with all change, this new paradigm creates a great deal of fear and uncertainty among lawyers, who are by training risk-averse.

......
A collection of hardbound volumes cannot generate the sort of interactivity and real-world information about lawyers and law firms that is experienced, contributed and compiled on Avvo every day. Information about lawyers is being shared by those who have first-hand experience, resulting in a searchable database of information that is accessible to prospective clients around the country and the world. If information is power, then Avvo effectively shifts the balance of power away from lawyers and law firms to clients, prospective clients and every other user of its Web site.

Campos' firm, a 20 lawyer commercial litigation and corporate securities boutique, is embracing the Avvo concept.

A comment about a lawyer posted on Avvo has the potential to reach a global audience, whereas the letter of gratitude sent to a law firm requires action on the part of the firm to publicize it. We decided to take advantage of the opportunity. We now display 'Avvo badges' on our Web site profiles of each of our lawyers, which link directly to each lawyer's profile on Avvo. Rather than fear what clients have to say about us, we embraced the possibilities created by empowering clients to weigh in directly on their experience working with a lawyer or law firm.

And clients of the law firm are using Avvo to the benefit of future clients and the firm.

Though certainly not true in every case..., clients will often post comments on the Avvo Web site shortly after the conclusion of a particular matter. Such comments generally provide considerable detail about the specific matter handled by their lawyer and their overall experience. When a client posts a review about a lawyer, Avvo's system asks how long ago the client used the lawyer's services. This kind of information is an invaluable tool for prospective clients seeking to gauge the most recent experience others have had with a particular lawyer. Not surprisingly, one of the more common uses of Avvo by clients is vetting word of mouth referrals.

And it's not only smaller firms embracing Avvo. Davis Wright Tremaine, an AmLaw 200 international law firm, claimed the Avvo Profiles of all 225 lawyers in their Seattle and Bellevue offices.

The Avvo concept is here to stay. Consumers of legal services who can get online reviews on dishwashers are going to demand, through their behavior, that comments about lawyers be freely available. Whether comments come from other lawyers or clients, the information is just too valuable.

Martindale-Hubbell has been suppressing this concept for years. They want a monopoly on lawyer ratings. Money to made there. Plus when you're charging law firms 10's and 100's of thousands of dollars to display their lawyers in a directory, you don't want law firm customers walking when they don't like what another lawyer or consumer has said.

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out. Martindale-Hubbell dismissed Google as a force in clients finding lawyers. Now their own studies find Google is viewed as an important source in locating counsel by almost 20% of corporate counsel. And Google didn't exist 8 years ago.

Avvo does have the staying power issue. Though VC backed, significant revenue generation will be necessary at some point. There's money via sponsorships, premium listings, and services, but will it be enough, and will it come soon enough.

And there's always the question whether LexisNexis will pay to just put a concept like Avvo's on the shelf. Though that's a little harder today with web based systems costing so little to develop and user generated content from all over continuing to flourish.

Related posts from elsewhere: